Really?

[JigStix]

Fishing is on fire, fish with me and I'll share information. For now, I won't post it here because I don't know you or trust you. Plus, so many people who post here were very anti my method of fishing when DNR got involved last year. They wanted to know why jigging was not targeted too. Rather than fight, they tried to take everyone down with them. Not people I want to share with.

[SimpleBiology]

Originally Posted by JigStix

Fishing is on fire, fish with me and I'll share information. For now, I won't post it here because I don't know you or trust you. Plus, so many people who post here were very anti my method of fishing when DNR got involved last year. They wanted to know why jigging was not targeted too. Rather than fight, they tried to take everyone down with them. Not people I want to share with.

Anti-your fishing method? You really believe that? A good angler will adapt to the most productive methods of fishing, 3/4 of the time I have a jigging rod in my hand and when the fish are spread out over vast distances I troll. I have no problems sharing info I just assumed I was inferior to the elders of the board. I've been fishing the area just south of the little choptank working the breaking fish and birds and the fishing has been wonderful. A moron can get it right when the birds tell them where to go.

As far as the debate about fishing regulations, I have no say, therefore I just fish. If I'm allowed to fish I will.

[JigStix]

Originally Posted by SimpleBiology

Anti-your fishing method? You really believe that? A good angler will adapt to the most productive methods of fishing, 3/4 of the time I have a jigging rod in my hand and when the fish are spread out over vast distances I troll. I have no problems sharing info I just assumed I was inferior to the elders of the board. I've been fishing the area just south of the little choptank working the breaking fish and birds and the fishing has been wonderful. A moron can get it right when the birds tell them where to go.

As far as the debate about fishing regulations, I have no say, therefore I just fish. If I'm allowed to fish I will.

Yes, I really believe that. And unless you were under a rock, or not here at all for the debates that ran wild through these boards, you would know I was right. As soon as DNR proposed regulations (and yes 5thTuition they were targeted at trolling) the trollers quickly turned on the jiggers and light tackle guys. Many names I see regularly on this board were very quick to start pointing fingers and throwing light tackle guys under the bus. Many so called proponents of no regulation were stating things like "Jiggers handle way more fish than any troller" "Fly fishermen fight fish way longer and therefore put more stress on the fish" "a good jigger can put 100 fish in the boat in a day whereas a good troller can put 20"

all of those statements were made over and over again by people on this board. People that left Tidalfish becuase their little feelings got hurt. And there began the great divide among fishing methods.

So, yes, I believe that. And I have rarely trolled, but if regulations were put in against my method of fishing, I would not act like a spurned 5 year old and say "well that's not fair, they need to be punished too"

PS Yes, you do have a say. Show up at the meetings. I was at every single one last year. Was my voice heard, not sure. I spoke at many of them, but stopped as soon as infighting began among fishermen

PPS I fish the same area as you and yes the fishing has been more than adequate

[SimpleBiology]

Originally Posted by JigStix

Yes, I really believe that. And unless you were under a rock, or not here at all for the debates that ran wild through these boards, you would know I was right. As soon as DNR proposed regulations (and yes 5thTuition they were targeted at trolling) the trollers quickly turned on the jiggers and light tackle guys. Many names I see regularly on this board were very quick to start pointing fingers and throwing light tackle guys under the bus. Many so called proponents of no regulation were stating things like "Jiggers handle way more fish than any troller" "Fly fishermen fight fish way longer and therefore put more stress on the fish" "a good jigger can put 100 fish in the boat in a day whereas a good troller can put 20"

all of those statements were made over and over again by people on this board. People that left Tidalfish becuase their little feelings got hurt. And there began the great divide among fishing methods.

So, yes, I believe that. And I have rarely trolled, but if regulations were put in against my method of fishing, I would not act like a spurned 5 year old and say "well that's not fair, they need to be punished too"

PS Yes, you do have a say. Show up at the meetings. I was at every single one last year. Was my voice heard, not sure. I spoke at many of them, but stopped as soon as infighting began among fishermen

PPS I fish the same area as you and yes the fishing has been more than adequate

I do live under a rock, I work rotating schedules and it's hard to keep in tune with what people say and do. Politically motivated people do not and will not listen, the great republic that our fore fathers built and their dreams died years ago with professional politicians.

As far as people leaving Tidalfish, I am unaware of that. I started using Cbangler because a guy at the boat show in Baltimore told me about it and how much smaller and easier it is to use. Tidalfish gets too many threads started and it's hard to keep up.

I have never been to any "meetings", I believe if the DNR limits what I can do for fishing then their doing so for a good scientific based reason. I supported alot of last years proposals from DNR, barbless hooks are smart, circle hooks prevent deep throat hooking and a reduction of trolling rods was meant to reduce the number of big reproducing females from being dragged therefore reducing delayed mortality, which is smart. I adapted all of the regulations without any problems to my fishing. The best trophy rock fishing this year was during the C&R. Most of the fish left before the "season" even started and I didn't lose a singe fish or have a single trip hampered by any of the said regulations.

"a good jigger can put 100 fish in the boat in a day whereas a good troller can put 20"
Thats why good anglers will adapt and use a jigging rod when they find fish.

Whats the name of your boat? I'll look for you when I'm out, I'm hoping as the water cools down we will get some good action working ccnp. I'm aboard a 25' chris craft named Daddy's Mess and a 21' parker center console named Daddy's Mess Jr.

By the way "gentleman" and Ladies I have never met any of you. Maybe that will change.


God Bless you, the fishing, and America.

[B-Faithful]

Originally Posted by JigStix

Yes, I really believe that. And unless you were under a rock, or not here at all for the debates that ran wild through these boards, you would know I was right. As soon as DNR proposed regulations (and yes 5thTuition they were targeted at trolling) the trollers quickly turned on the jiggers and light tackle guys. Many names I see regularly on this board were very quick to start pointing fingers and throwing light tackle guys under the bus. Many so called proponents of no regulation were stating things like "Jiggers handle way more fish than any troller" "Fly fishermen fight fish way longer and therefore put more stress on the fish" "a good jigger can put 100 fish in the boat in a day whereas a good troller can put 20"

all of those statements were made over and over again by people on this board. People that left Tidalfish becuase their little feelings got hurt. And there began the great divide among fishing methods.

So, yes, I believe that. And I have rarely trolled, but if regulations were put in against my method of fishing, I would not act like a spurned 5 year old and say "well that's not fair, they need to be punished too"

PS Yes, you do have a say. Show up at the meetings. I was at every single one last year. Was my voice heard, not sure. I spoke at many of them, but stopped as soon as infighting began among fishermen

PPS I fish the same area as you and yes the fishing has been more than adequate

I think you may not have understood the process or what was going on. The first true proposal that was adopted at the SFAC meeting was aimed at everyone regardless of how they fished. It was the day closure proposal that got so many people up in arms and it wasnt proposed by any specific fishermen but by some of those on the SFAC. It was the DNR proposal that was targetted towards trollers. No preseason fishermen was looking to reduce the efficiency of any other fishermen with the exception of a few like Tom Hughes and a few others. It was obvious that soley the efficiency of trollers that was targetted by DNR. However, Any preseason fishermen I know didnt want to see efficiency targetted at all for any fishermen regardless of how they fished. I believe most would concede regulations that would reduce mortality rates but not ones that reduced ones opportunity to catch a fish.

I actually think that it was pretty good that most fishermen who were actively involved stuck together and fought day closures. Examples of how some light tackle people are productive were only to demonstrate that DNR has no clue to what type of fishermen is more efficient and the targetting of efficiency is unjust (as most fishermen know, any method can be more efficient than another on a given day). There is no way to reduce efficiency on light tackle fishermen without closing areas or days to fishing and NO ONE I know who supported access to fishing during the preseaon would support such regulations. Even trollers would rather have gear restrictions over day closures and fought hard to make sure day closures were not enacted. Opportunity to fish is zero during a day closure even if it is greatly reduced through gear restrictions

In regards to the divide between those who enjoy trolling and those who only like to jig during the preseason, I believe that came after the whole preseason debate when there were a number of threads posted to ridicule the use of trolling gear during the trophy season (as it came on the heals of efficiency restrictions trollers faced and relatively much lower catch rate during the preseason). I say this even despite the facts that the CCA noted that they would have signed onto a one rod per person restriction that the CBF represenative proposed if it meant no day closures and Tom Hughes and a few others were calling for one rod per person restrictions at the meetings which would have rendered trolling so inefficient that it wouldnt have made it worth the effort. I will remind you that no one went on record at the DNR calling for the closure of the rips or other areas of concentration that light tackle guys like to fish despite some good fishing and high number catches reported there because no one would want that. Heck, we would want to fish those areas if trolling isnt effective enough

Obviously everyone has their perception of what happened. All I know is that it was bitter-sweet. The opportunity to fish during the preseason didnt get shut down, nor were day closures implimented. However, unfortunately the opportunity to catch fish while trolling was greatly reduced without sound justification and there seems to be more a divide amoungst fishermen today. Either way, I am glad to still be able to fish the bay all year in whatever method I believe will give me the greatest enjoyment.

I state all this not to further the divide but to offer another perspective and hope deminish the riff that appears to be there. I enjoy all types of fishing whether it is trolling, jigging, chumming, livelining spot or eels, etc. I just like to catch fish and be on the water. Some of the guys who fish with me are die-hard light tackle guys and we have a great time on the water no matter how we fish.

Hopefully we all can focus on the fall season and not focus so much on the issues of the past.

[5th Tuition]

Everyone needs to stay united; I'm afraid "round two" may be coming this winter.
5th (Marty)

[JigStix]

Originally Posted by 5th Tuition

Everyone needs to stay united; I'm afraid "round two" may be coming this winter.
5th (Marty)

Well said 5th Tuition!

[SimpleBiology]

Originally Posted by JigStix

Well said 5th Tuition!

I think this kind of conversation is good, it gives anglers the opportunity to reflect on other anglers views.

I do believe that recreational anglers should be united against greedy commercial fisherman and that all of us should do whatever it takes to protect our fisheries.

Back to Jigstix comment, Who ran their trolling lines through nets or should I ask what a gannet beehive is before assuming? I know what a the bird gannet is however not the phrase. Did that make a serious mess? Assuming it recieved alot of attention.

[JigStix]

Originally Posted by B-Faithful

I think you may not have understood the process or what was going on. The first true proposal that was adopted at the SFAC meeting was aimed at everyone regardless of how they fished. It was the day closure proposal that got so many people up in arms and it wasnt proposed by any specific fishermen but by some of those on the SFAC. It was the DNR proposal that was targetted towards trollers. No preseason fishermen was looking to reduce the efficiency of any other fishermen with the exception of a few like Tom Hughes and a few others. It was obvious that soley the efficiency of trollers that was targetted by DNR. However, Any preseason fishermen I know didnt want to see efficiency targetted at all for any fishermen regardless of how they fished. I believe most would concede regulations that would reduce mortality rates but not ones that reduced ones opportunity to catch a fish.

I actually think that it was pretty good that most fishermen who were actively involved stuck together and fought day closures. Examples of how some light tackle people are productive were only to demonstrate that DNR has no clue to what type of fishermen is more efficient and the targetting of efficiency is unjust (as most fishermen know, any method can be more efficient than another on a given day). There is no way to reduce efficiency on light tackle fishermen without closing areas or days to fishing and NO ONE I know who supported access to fishing during the preseaon would support such regulations. Even trollers would rather have gear restrictions over day closures and fought hard to make sure day closures were not enacted. Opportunity to fish is zero during a day closure even if it is greatly reduced through gear restrictions

In regards to the divide between those who enjoy trolling and those who only like to jig during the preseason, I believe that came after the whole preseason debate when there were a number of threads posted to ridicule the use of trolling gear during the trophy season (as it came on the heals of efficiency restrictions trollers faced and relatively much lower catch rate during the preseason). I say this even despite the facts that the CCA noted that they would have signed onto a one rod per person restriction that the CBF represenative proposed if it meant no day closures and Tom Hughes and a few others were calling for one rod per person restrictions at the meetings which would have rendered trolling so inefficient that it wouldnt have made it worth the effort. I will remind you that no one went on record at the DNR calling for the closure of the rips or other areas of concentration that light tackle guys like to fish despite some good fishing and high number catches reported there because no one would want that. Heck, we would want to fish those areas if trolling isnt effective enough

Obviously everyone has their perception of what happened. All I know is that it was bitter-sweet. The opportunity to fish during the preseason didnt get shut down, nor were day closures implimented. However, unfortunately the opportunity to catch fish while trolling was greatly reduced without sound justification and there seems to be more a divide amoungst fishermen today. Either way, I am glad to still be able to fish the bay all year in whatever method I believe will give me the greatest enjoyment.

I state all this not to further the divide but to offer another perspective and hope deminish the riff that appears to be there. I enjoy all types of fishing whether it is trolling, jigging, chumming, livelining spot or eels, etc. I just like to catch fish and be on the water. Some of the guys who fish with me are die-hard light tackle guys and we have a great time on the water no matter how we fish.

Hopefully we all can focus on the fall season and not focus so much on the issues of the past.

Believe me, I understand the process, and I know who you are and was at all but maybe one or two meetings last year. Just because I'm a redneck, does not make me a dumb redneck. You were very outstpoken, as were quite a few others on Tidalfish. In the beginning it was quite a good debate. But, then I saw the posts you refer to between you and some of the more promintent jiggers. Not just you, but a few others too. I know what they said to you, and I saw what you all said to them. Then I saw it start to get personal. I saw one person finally have it with you, and I saw you indirectly blast another prominent light tackle fisherman who just bought one of the boats you represent. Probably not your best moment I assume. Believe me, I understand the process, and I understand what went on behind the scenes, and I understand the defensive posture many trollers took (and justifiably so), but the light tackle guys stood right beside you and fought even though it did not effect them at all. I'm not so sure the outspoken trollers would have done the same had the shoe been on the other foot.. What I dont understand is how it got so out of hand.

Yes, there was some teasing going on, but you fellas always tease on this board. Just seems you were a little more sensitive (and understandbly so) about this craziness. What I don't understand is why they (you included) began to ask the question "why are there no restrictions on jiggers" "why are you only targeting trolling." When you resigned yourself to the fact that you were getting trolling restrictions, rather than regroup and say "how are we going to fix this going forward", you began to lash out. Not all the time, but you and others got quite defensive. It was as if you wished since there were restrictions on trolling, other methods should get them too, not what should have been done; and that is to work together and have the restrictions taken away in the future. I don't know if it was you or one of your friends, but what stuck in my craw was the comment I read "well you jiggers can just deal with it, because now us trollers are going to start flooding all your spots. See how you like that"

Remember, it was a troller, trolling through a gannet bee hive that started the mess to begin with. If you didn't feel the need to brag all the time and post all your big dead rockfish, none of this mess would have happened. I have no problem with you, I like what you stand for mostly, but you are partially guilty for the divide.

At this point, yes, I agree with you. Let's let the past be the past, but if this mess comes up again, let's all think twice and work together and keep the infighting to a minimum. I have since moved to south county so access to Annapolis meetings are out of my range, but you localy boys are gonna need to be there. My sources say we will see quite a few more proposals this winter, so we need to be ready and make sure we keep full access to the resource. Keep charging hard young man and keep 'er on point and we'll have lots of fish to catch for a long time.

[5th Tuition]

This topic is mostly what turned me off toward Tidalfish. There are too few of us on THIS board to lose anyone over past actions. As JigStix says, we need to stay vigalent on future restrictions.

GettinJiggyWidIt (JigStix); did you get my PM?

5th (Marty)