Rec on Rec fishing...

[B-Faithful]

I posted this in a response on a thread on TF and thought it warranted being discussed over here. While I know a lot of the back and forth is in fun and I enjoy that as much as most, I do have concerns that that some of this rec on rec setiment is gaining traction and serves little good to recreational fishing as a whole. Lets face it, even DNR was at SPSP taking surveys this week and was not even looking at the fish. They wanted to know how long an angler fished, how many rods they trolled if they were trolling, and how many fish were caught/kept (without a check). I am unware of any fish inspections that took place to check the size of the fish, sex of the fish kept, whether or not they carried roe, etc. I know DNR does do some gill net surveys to check these things and maybe it is possible that other surveys of the sort were taken in other areas of the bay but I found it odd that they were concerned about rod numbers when information about the fish being caught on artificials would seem more pressing to me. Afterall, all recreational anglers can only keep one fish over 28" this time of year anyhow so the rod question seems irrelivant unless people were keeping more fish than their limit.

Well, here is what I had said:

It appears that there is a growing feeling of superiority for their method of fishing or concerns that trollers are catching more fish due to their use of a greater number of rods by some on the fishing forums and local light tackle bloggers. I would like to address this trend. While trollers tend to use more rods at once, they are attempting to cover large open areas of the bay and not stay on structure. Trollers tend not to run 100 miles in a day looking for signs of heavier fish concentrations but stay close to port and find a few fish. Dont get me wrong, there will be big number reports occassionally by the troller who finds a good concentration of fish. However this is not the norm and the same for other methods of fishing. Just as there is the occassional report of trollers catching high numbers of fish, there are reports here of light tackle guys handling 50-100 fish between just a couple of guys on boat on the flats and in the rips. It only takes a few minutes to scan through the reports here and other places to see that despite trolling with planerboards and the use of several rods per angler that the vast majority of anglers are fortunate to catch a few fish each. As one who launches out of the most popular access point in the state, I will say that this becomes very evident from speaking with other anglers. This is also evident through DNR and MRFSS studies that show about one fish is caught per 3 angler trips on the bay.

Trolling is a very popular method of fishing due to the ability to find a few fish that are not in higher concentrations and not having to run very far from home. It also a way where more anglers can fish together effectively and safely while working as a team in different capacities. Trolling is a method that is used by many on the bay to get out and enjoy our most-prized, beautiful natural resource. This is evident by the amount of people on the water utilizing this method this time of year.

I believe some of these concerns and growing attitude towards those who troll is probably due to the crowds that many fishermen encounter this time of year. While I too can get frustrated by the crowds of people fishing this time of year in some areas (trollers in the channels, light tackle guys in the flats, rips or around the bridge, chummers off Hacketts or love point, even sailboaters outside the severn, etc), I do fully appreciate the fact that so many other recreational users are out enjoying the public natural resource. Because so many citizens directly enjoy the resource, I know that issues pertaining to its health will get more attention. By those enjoying the resource through recreational angling and having such a strong economic impact to our state regardless of how they enjoy to fish, it gives us fishermen ammuniton to argue to retain our access and opportunity over other interests.

With all this said, I ask that recreational anglers to stop its apparent migration towards criticizing those who dont enjoy the type of fishing that a particular angler favors. We all have the same creel limit, season length, and fish size regulations regarldess of how one choses to enjoy fishing. Also let's face it, regardless of how you fish, if everyone fished like you, your spots would be even more crowded.

all I can say is glad I've barely looked at these boards in a while...I will reserve my full answer (just as I do my reports now) for PM, phone, or person to person. This can only stir up a hornets nest. I had to go look for it on TF, but it appears that thread started out pretty calm and went downhill

I've been preaching since C&R started that **** like this was going to happen...but Greg, I'll be honest, I think Jamie's post was as bland as it gets, honestly just asking a question and then it got blown out of proportion. I don't know Jamie as well as I know a lot of the great LT fishermen, but I don't think any of them have an air of superiority at all. People getting defensive, then getting others defensive, causing fishermen to fight, causing us to lose rights...I could go on, but as I said, I don't want everything on the interweb for all to see...I don't think this post can do anything but cause further division that was not there, or make any that was there worse...

[reeltor]

There is still lobbying going on behind some doors to further restrict trolling by RECS. You might or might not troll but we'd better stick together or sooner than later we'll ALL be running, gunning and fighting to get to the birds first.
Anyone remember the Dumping Grounds in the old "bumper boat" days?

I can assure Greg has nothing but respect for Jamie and the LTJ gang.

[Reverb]

I'm not gonna get into it, but Jamies a gentlemen's gentlemen.

His first reports were often to educate anglers on TF, and then it turned into a pissing match.

[B-Faithful]

I am sure Jamies post wasnt intended as a stone and as I stated over there that I should be clear that my previous post is not intented towards Jumbo, who started this thread, or any other individual. I just want to address the seemingly growing divide amoungst recreational fishermen that is becoming more and more evident to ensure that we all continue to work together to have access and opportunity to fish the bay in the manner which we enjoy most. I think all recreational fishermen will be better served by appreciating one another and advocating management with better access for all through harvest season length, creel limits and size limits.

I greatly value Jamie and others who share their knowledge of jigging. I have learned a lot from them over the years and hope to continue to do so. They are inspirations for anglers to get on the water and try to catch a fish!

[Bug Guy]

I don't want to be part of the pissing match over their either, Jamie has helped me in the past and I won't get into it about his thread - I don't really care because I don't get too worried about threads on forums in the grand scheme of things.

But, I'll say this - from what I've heard and experienced myself, this week has been slow. What happens when the "data" comes in and shows guys trolling 16-20 lines pulling in 0-5 fish consistently and the guys with 4 rods getting 0-2. Sounds like reason not to have any rod restrictions because having big spreads really isn't making a real difference right now. Of course, there is always that outlier when for instance, you get a late start and have a good day in shallow water In short, I'm not worried about the survey. Besides, if the powers to be wanted "data" showing some extreme number of rods per boat, they'd just make it up like they did in the past.

[Shawn Kimbro]

I didn't see anything critical of trolling in Jamie's comments. Since I guess it was my blog you are referring to, I think most everyone here knows what I think of trolling. If that was the only way I could catch a fish, I'd shoot myself. I'm too ADD. That's my personal issue, doesn't have anything to do with what you do except I hope there's plenty of beer on the boat if you take me trolling. That said, I don't care if you do and more power to you although I do think it's a little rediculous to resort to dozens of rods.

I've supported trolling in political discussions and was squarely in your corner during the C&R depate. I haven't heard anything about DNR looking to limit rods. If they do, I don't have a dog in the fight so I won't be involved.

What I am advocating with my VAMPIRE WEEKEND post on CLT is going to all C&R through the trophy season. If you can stand the smell, go take a look in the dumpster at Breezy Point and count the carcasses with eggs. If my opposition to that strikes you as rec on rec, then so be it. I'm opposed to killing the cows, not to fishing for them.

[B-Faithful]

Shawn, i appreciate you chiming in. You are always a stand-up guy and I fully respect you and your opinions. While we may agree on most things, there may be times where we offer different perspectives. I hope we can always have open dialogue and a nice friendship.

A couple of your recent articles were just some of the numerous things written that has been brought to my attention regarding what is being seen by some as a rising anti-trolling setiment in the recreational fishing community. I must say that I do fear some of the language within the article does foster some of the setiment I am seeing rise. Being that you are highly respected by so many, including myself, and you work on the CCA legislative committee and closely with the CBF on some projects, your perspectives carry a lot more weight than most. Of course your articles were just one source of the many comments made regarding trolling throughout the spring and winter.

A lot of this publicly written online feedback by some combined with recently proposed and implimented greater restrictions specifically on trolling during catch and release only season, DNR focus on efficiency over the increased numbers of fish harvest last spring on the recreational side (still less than 1 fish for every 3 trips taken),and recent rod surveys taken at access points has many of us who thoroughly enjoy trolling as a method of fishing in the spring, has me concerned over further targeted restrictions. I can only speak for myself in stating that I dont think that is the best way to manage the fishery for sustainability while enhansing and enticing the citizens of the state to participate in the recreation. I also believe that attempting to reduce efficiency, while it is still relatively low, to be good precedence for future management. I fear it will have a negative impact on the still growing recreational fishing paticipation. As I stated in the other forum, we all strive to maximize our efficiency so we can best enjoy the act of fishing. It is why we spend so much money on the latest and greatest equipment like electronics, search for common areas that hold fish, and look for signs of higher concentration of fish. I personally would like to see any reductions on the harvest of fish be done through the basics in recreational fishing management: creel limits, harvest season, length, and size limits. *

The above is why I wanted to start this thread. I wanted to address this issue or even just a potential issue before there was too much seperation in the unity of the user groups. While some may disagree with when the trophy season starts and/or what the regulations are around what fish we can keep, we all have the same regulations to live by regardless of how we fish. I think we all need to keep the finger pointing down about other recreation fishermen who choose to fish differently. I believe we all need to focus on the debate over the basics of fisheries management (both on the recreational and commercial side). I dont state this a troller but as a recreational fishermen, who wants to see recreational fishing enhansed for all who desire to access our resource.

(*given the creel limits are 1 per person and the trophy season is such a draw and economic impact to our recreational fishing community, I suggest that size limits would make the best consideration -- no take slot to ensure more fish are released would be the best consideration IMHO. It would provide for the chance to keep a fish, land a fish of lifetime, retain records, and reduce the number of fish being harvested. I believe it would still retain participation levels of the trophy season as evident when we had such regulations a few years ago -- An area where we may disagree).

[mdracer]

This entire thread is "much ado about nothing". Why anyone would care about how another fishes is beyond me. Everybody has their favorite way to fish. Who cares? Enjoy the sport the way you like. I don't eat rockfish so I release all that I catch. Doesn't make me any better then the guy that keeps his. It's called choice. We've all heard "different strokes for different folks". I can't see why a controversy should start about how one elects to fish. The best bet is to ignore posts that get into that sort of thing. That is the fastest way they will stop. Nobody has to defend they way they fish to anyone. In fact we used to call the guys that started these kind of threads "trollers". Just looking to create unnecessary problems between fishermen. Let it die and enjoy fishing for what it is not what you think it should be.

[Shawn Kimbro]

Don't sweat it, Greg. I also think bait fishermen are dimwits and fly fishermen are pansies. I work hard at being an equal opportunity offender.

CLT is mostly written for light tackle anglers or those who want to be. One of the goals is to show that you don't have to spend a zillion dollars on equipment or drag around rake handles to catch the big ones. Some of the fun of light tackle is taking pot-shots at the trollers, especially when we're in shallow water and set up over big fish and we see you guys idling by looking bored. On the other hand, I've been pretty envious of trollers after I've run 95 miles and barely wet a line.

I'm not trying to get up a bandwagon to limit rods and I know a few trollers who are actually pretty good fishermen. In fact, I'm hoping to get out with some of you guys to do some cradle net videos sometime soon. I say do whatever you can to have a good time. And, Lord knows I'm no more influential than the next guy with DNR. The C&R thing proves that.

On the other hand, if you want to argue about killing the pre-spawn cows..... I'm your huckleberry!